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Post by mtbdudex on Oct 15, 2008 9:56:53 GMT -7
I own a Denon 4308CI receiver - bought Jan-2008, Denon announced a $100 upgrade via firmware two weeks ago, the two big items I'm looking at is Audyssey Dynamic EQ and Audyssey Dynamic Volume. From Denon site: www.usa.denon.com/dynamicvolume/www.usa.denon.com/upgrade/Lots of talk on this avs thread (and some non-related chatter as well): www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1065934&page=14Prior review @ audioholics: www.audioholics.com/news/trade-show-coverage/2007-cedia-expo/audyssey-dynamic-eq.htmlAnybody here have experience with Audyssey Dynamic EQ and their IB sub, particular at low/mid volumes? Was there perceptual difference (enhanced bass experience at low/mid volumes) to justify some upgrade fee? (in your subjective opinion of course). Denon is charging $100 upgrade fee for these and 3 others feature upgrades. From Audyssey site: www.audyssey.com/technology/dynamicEQ.htmlAudyssey technologies work together to solve the complex problems that arise when attempting to reproduce sound as it was originally conceived. Audyssey Dynamic Volume includes Audyssey Dynamic EQ™, which compensates for deteriorating sound quality as volume is decreased by taking into account human perception and room acoustics.
As part of Dynamic Volume, Dynamic EQ selects the best possible frequency response and surround volume levels on a moment-by-moment basis. These two technologies enable the full frequency response of the source at its original level to be reproduced at any listening level. Even at lower listening volumes, Dynamic Volume ensures that the richness and dynamics of the response are maintained.
Dynamic Volume employs advanced audio signal processing that operates in both the time and frequency domains. The spectral content in individual channels and the surround mix are continuously monitored in order to maintain proper spatial volume. Both rapid and slow changes in level and dynamics are monitored in order to prevent the common artifacts produced by standard compressor methods.
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Post by mtbdudex on Oct 16, 2008 15:35:18 GMT -7
I'm guessing this feature is too new and there are NO current IB set-up's that use Audyssey Dynamic EQ yet? I've still not upgraded just yet........But it is tempting to have something new to play with and learn.  |
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Post by jman on Oct 16, 2008 19:13:35 GMT -7
dynamic eq = loudness contour
dynamic volume = compressor
Audyssey = nonsense
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Post by joesparti on Nov 4, 2008 1:39:08 GMT -7
I bought a Integra 5.9 (comes with Aud 2EQ) and tried it out with my IB. Basically, the bass was way too pronounced and way overbearing.
When you check the forums running AUD threads, the major complaints centres around its Bass adjustments and I think the concensus is it has no idea.
So I just used Aud to set up all my HT speakers, timings and EQ adjustments for my room. Then after that I tuned the IB in myself changing the x-over adjustments to my mains and volume on the IB itself.
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Post by crackyflipside on Jan 13, 2009 15:34:42 GMT -7
Before:  After Audyssey:  |
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Post by jman on Jan 14, 2009 1:32:52 GMT -7
DSP cannot do what those graphs suggest.
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Post by crackyflipside on Jan 14, 2009 12:06:52 GMT -7
DSP cannot do what those graphs suggest. It's just what Audysey did after I ran it to correct levels / distance / eq / etc... |
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Eskimo
Full Member
Bass-head
Posts: 143
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Post by Eskimo on Jan 14, 2009 12:57:09 GMT -7
Looks like it boosted your 20hz quite a bit which can be harmful to the sub... Honestly, I like the first graph better, but that's a damn good response to begin with. |
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Post by jasonshep on Jan 18, 2009 9:24:03 GMT -7
I bought a Integra 5.9 (comes with Aud 2EQ) and tried it out with my IB. Basically, the bass was way too pronounced and way overbearing. Audyssey 2eq is the most basic version & provides no correction on the lfe channel. I use a Denon avp-a1hd with Audyssey multeq xt & it is sublime with my 8 x 15'' IB. Dynamic eq is great with tv & movies but i turn it off for music & run Audyssey flat.I would not be without it  |
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Post by mtbdudex on Feb 1, 2009 13:01:32 GMT -7
Related to Audyssey EQ and IB subs. I'm now using 2 filters via my FBQ2496, and in the "Audyssey setup guide" on avsforum they state 2 things I'd like to know what others here in the Cult with Audyssey are doing: -Raise low pass filter to 120hz if allowed on receiver/processor -Don't change the subwoofer distance calc, Audyssey calc's all the processor delays (including the FBQ2496 I assume) and takes that into account This is contrary to the add 1 foot rule of thumb I've read. (which was before people started to use Audyssey much?) What are others here doing? I'm ok with raising crossover above 80hz, seems my IB does not fall off per measurements so why not use those drivers range? Light green curve if current set-up with 2 filters:  Here is link to set-up guide, www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14456895#post14456895. One of the founders of Audyssey is on that thread almost daily so it's about as bible direction from Audyssey as you can get. Below from that: VII. After Calibration
B. Raise the low-pass filter setting (usually incorrectly identified as a crossover) of the LFE subwoofer in the receiver / processor to 120Hz, if allowed.
1. Incorrect distance measurements for the satellite speakers indicate a procedural error, and the associated EQ results are likely to be poor.
D. Do not change the distance setting of the subwoofer.
1. Inaccurate subwoofer distance settings are the result of measured delays between the time when the receiver outputs the test tone and it is received at the microphone.
a. Any filters and/or active circuitry in subwoofers can delay this signal.
b. Audyssey simply measures the time delay and compensates for differences in the arrival time of sound from the various speakers and the subwoofer. It is best to compensate for these differences regardless of why they occur.
2. The subwoofer / satellite speaker time alignment blend is based on this measurement.
3. Inaccurate subwoofer distance measurements usually occur when the subwoofer’s Low-Pass Filter (LPF) is not disabled.
a. The LPF, by nature of its design, introduces additional delay to the signal; Audyssey detects and corrects for this delay.
H. If desired, trim adjustments can be made in the receiver / processor, so that all speakers measure at 75 dB with an SPL meter (set at “C” and “Slow”) using the internal test tones. See “Note 2” below.
1. Audyssey will monitor these changes.
2. The changes are monitored so that Audyssey and its features (Room correction curves, Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume, etc.) work as designed.
3. If you were to make changes to the settings on a subwoofer, Audyssey would have no knowledge of this, and those features would not operate as designed. |
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Post by mtbdudex on Feb 4, 2009 4:01:52 GMT -7
Chris (Founder and CTO of Audyssey) answered my Q's in avsfoum, raised some www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15729471#post15729471. I'm sure others here have crossed this before, Audyssey MultEQ XT vs FBQ2496? Can the two co-exist in mutual win-win scenario? If people have Audyssey MultEQ XT and it truly handles the bass EQ as well is there then no need for traditional parametric EQ for subs? (open ended Q, I don't mean to offend anyone here) I know, wide open Q's, I should be prepared for some "hot" responses.... Guys, I'm just trying to gather info, learn, and do the "right thing" in the end for my HT sound. My Q's, and Chris(Audyssey) answers:
2nd Q:
Other forums recommend adding 1 foot to sub distance for FBQ2496, however Audyssey MultEQ already takes into account that time delay and I don't have to do that, correct?
That's correct. If you measure through the FBQ then MultEQ measures the delay that it adds and compensates for it.
3rd Q:
How much EQ/processing does Audyssey MultEQ do in the subwoofer area?
I have a nice slope/house curve for seat 3 via FBQ2496, would then Audyssey MultEQ flatten that out or leave it as is?
MultEQ is not about house curves and personal preferences. It measures each speaker and then applies a correction filter that will make that speaker play as close as possible to the curve used in mixing the content. For film, that is a flat curve in the bass with no slope.
All my sub measurements were thru the Ext In, so no Audyssey EQ was measured.
OK. One big source of inaccuracy in low frequency measurements is taking them in one position. You will get a much better idea of what you will hear in the listening area if you can average the measurements. The averaging needs to be RMS (root mean square) and not simple arithmetic averaging in order to get meaningful results.
I don't know how much further I'm going to pursue this..... I "like" what Audyssey MultEQ XT does for my 7.1 speaker set-up, the sound "sounds" great to me, that's what it's all about, right? My sub, I was kinda "proud" to have a decent 2nd row sub response and only apply 2 filters, now I find that MultEQ XT may be doing it's thing on top of that? I'll take some measurements thru the receiver with MultEQ XT on/off and my FBQ2496 on/off in 2nd row 4 positions and 1st row 3 seat to see what's going on. Then post in the avsforum more Q's to Chris. If anything, I might learn more about room acoustics, graphs, etc. I'll try not to learn just enough to be "dangerous/stupid" with my Q's, rather keep asking open ended Q's with still some specific focus, based upon fact measurements. |
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jonfo
New Member
Posts: 34 
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Post by jonfo on Feb 15, 2009 12:43:13 GMT -7
Just as an extra data point I have a Denon AVP-A1HDci and also own the Audyssey Pro calibration kit. I also perform all my crossovers for all my speakers using DBX DriveRacks. I use the parametric EQ in my DriveRack 4800 to do a couple of bands of EQ on the sub. The result of Audyssey correction is amazing, so correct it’s uncanny. This is mostly notable in the timing department. I’d tried to get time-alignment to within a fraction of a millisecond between all speakers, and impulse responses confirmed I was spot –on, but Audyssey brings it to a new level. On my 4x15” IB sub, the combo of great equipment, plus room treatments, plus room correction is bass than has to be heard to be believed. Not boomy, just tight and accurate. Musicians comment on just how ‘realistic’ the bass is now, and how ‘tight’ the notes are in the bass. Dynamic EQ is a god-send. It really works and I find it enables me to listen at much lower volumes than before and still enjoy the recordings as much. Highly recommended, but it does take a LOT of care in how you run the calibration measurements. |
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