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AE IB15
Nov 30, 2007 13:50:26 GMT -7
Post by jasonshep on Nov 30, 2007 13:50:26 GMT -7
I would like to say how impressed i am with the build quality of my AEIB15's that i received yesterday,they were shipped to the uk by BAX and have arrived in perfect condition,i would give Acoustic Elegance a unreserved recommendation
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AE IB15
Nov 30, 2007 14:08:37 GMT -7
Post by ThomasW on Nov 30, 2007 14:08:37 GMT -7
Good news....... Now everyone will be jealous of your handmade drivers imported from the states ....
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AE IB15
Nov 30, 2007 14:21:16 GMT -7
Post by jasonshep on Nov 30, 2007 14:21:16 GMT -7
I'm hoping they will be even more jelous when they hear them ;D thanks for all the help i've had so far from this forum,it is greatly appreciated
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AE IB15
Dec 1, 2007 22:54:53 GMT -7
Post by aaks38 on Dec 1, 2007 22:54:53 GMT -7
Jasonshep, do let us know how they workout and sound.
Ive just about convinced myself to get 4 of the AE IB 15s.
Thanks for your feedback.
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Post by jasonshep on Dec 2, 2007 4:35:47 GMT -7
Hi aaks38, its going to be some time in the new year before i can install my ib so cant help you with how they sound just yet,however i feel very confident with the aeib15's,John seems to have put alot of effort into their design specifically for ib use and as this forum is full of very knowledgable people it would not be wise to make claims for their performance that they do not meet. Chrisbee has just replaced his old aeib15's with the new model and from what i have read seems very happy with them,hopefully he can give you some more info on them. good luck with your install jason
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Post by aaks38 on Dec 4, 2007 9:32:51 GMT -7
well I ended up ordering 4 of the AE IBs. I also felt these drivers look very high quality and have some great specs to back them up.
Im looking forward to creating 2 manifolds in my basement walls. Ill chime in on my results.
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AE IB15
Mar 7, 2008 14:52:22 GMT -7
Post by bricktop on Mar 7, 2008 14:52:22 GMT -7
Didn't want to start a new thread so I thought I would put this question here. I am curious about the how much Fs really affects the output of an IB sub. I am considering an IB with 2 ficar IB18s or 4 AE IB15s. I modeled them in winiso and see that the AEIB 15 has a better low end extension, but the ficar has a SPL advantage just over 1db, but that is up at 100 Hz. Putting aside room interactions, how will this slight difference I see play itself out in a real setup? Will the lower extension of the AE be a very noticeable advantage over the ficar? Also, I am surprised the SPL levels as modeled are so close considering the difference in displacement. Could that be right?
Thanks, Jonathon
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AE IB15
Mar 7, 2008 15:18:37 GMT -7
Post by diycable on Mar 7, 2008 15:18:37 GMT -7
The displacement has nothing to do with the T/S parameters nor how it models so it doesn't matter if the driver has 1mm or 55mm of X-max.
You don't need the efficiency up over 100Hz do you? Where are you going to play them? Thats all that matters, the bandwidth your trying to use them in.
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AE IB15
Mar 7, 2008 15:31:27 GMT -7
Post by bricktop on Mar 7, 2008 15:31:27 GMT -7
OK, so what your saying is that the actual SPL will be different, and if the ficar 18s have more displacement, they will more likely play louder? What about the Fs...does that really have much effect when being driven? Seems to me that since it plays above it's resonant frequency, it should play below it just fine.
I will be crossing these over at 80Hz max, so I do not need the upper end extension.
Thanks for the answers, Jonathon
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AE IB15
Mar 7, 2008 21:01:35 GMT -7
Post by diycable on Mar 7, 2008 21:01:35 GMT -7
OK, so what your saying is that the actual SPL will be different, and if the ficar 18s have more displacement, they will more likely play louder? What about the Fs...does that really have much effect when being driven? Seems to me that since it plays above it's resonant frequency, it should play below it just fine. I will be crossing these over at 80Hz max, so I do not need the upper end extension. Thanks for the answers, Jonathon Ignore the Fs, its just one parameter and alone it doesn't tell you how the driver is going to perform in a given application except in a very limited way. Think of it this way. If I told you I had a sister that I wanted to fix you up with. Lets say I tell you she has big hooters. You think.. yea!.... I'll go out with her if she has some big hooters! I fix you up and you find out she is 500lbs and has some BIG hooters along with big everything else. Its not one parameter that is going to determine how it performs. Sure... big tits help, but you have to look at the entire package. Model both and see what you get. More excursion just gets you more output assuming you have the power to use it. Also... X-max just tells you the BL limits (motor). It doesn't necessarily tell you anything about the suspension limits or the mechanical limits of the driver.
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AE IB15
Mar 7, 2008 23:24:14 GMT -7
Post by bricktop on Mar 7, 2008 23:24:14 GMT -7
I did model both in winISD and found the -3db point on the 4 AE 15 drivers was almost 10Hz lower than the 2 ficar 18s at 16Hz vs 26Hz. Since I have zero experience with any of this, I was curious how close this was to reality and just what affect it would have on the actual sound in a room.
Thanks, Jonathon
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Post by ThomasW on Mar 8, 2008 9:07:20 GMT -7
Any sim shows the driver operating in anechoic space. Since most people don't live in an anechoic chamber 'room gain' fills in the lowest octaves and tends equalize out most of the advantage seen when someone models a low Fs driver. You can see a real world example of the effects of room gain on this page. home.comcast.net/~thomasw-2/SubwooferSetupandEQpage4.html
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 10:17:39 GMT -7
Post by chrisbee on Mar 8, 2008 10:17:39 GMT -7
Here are two sets of IB15 drivers. An old set with 32Hz Fs and a new set with 16Hz Fs. It is obvious how much extra bottom end there is straight out of the box with the lower Fs.
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 10:33:35 GMT -7
Post by ThomasW on Mar 8, 2008 10:33:35 GMT -7
Here are two sets of IB15 drivers. An old set with 32Hz Fs and a new set with 16Hz Fs. It is obvious how much extra bottom end there is straight out of the box with the lower Fs. As much as anything that's an example of the effects of the extremely stiff suspension used in the first batch of AE-IB15"s.
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 11:24:22 GMT -7
Post by chrisbee on Mar 8, 2008 11:24:22 GMT -7
It is interesting how much more power is required to achieve the same roll off with the 32Hz drivers using BFD boost compared with the new drivers.
In practice the new IB15s are very much louder than the old. At east 6dB and probably more.
I keep wondering whether I should order four new drivers rather than just add the old set to the new in a second manifold.
I would drive each set of four with a different channel of the EP2500 so at least in theory I could match their response and output.
The general advice here is always to obtain more of the same rather than mix drivers.
Since this problem is likely to come up with other owners of the old IB15 drivers I'd value expert opinion on this.
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 11:52:23 GMT -7
Post by bricktop on Mar 8, 2008 11:52:23 GMT -7
So in your experience the difference in low end extension will not be significant or very noticeable once installed? Is it easier to have more output and back the upper frequencies down to make the lower frequencies more in line, or is it better to start with a more flat extended response to start with? Here is what WinISD shows: img187.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ae15vsficar18db9.jpgThanks again, Jonathon What Chrisbee's graph illustrates is not the effect of a lower Fs necessarily, but other factors as well? his begs another question, what other driver parameter changes were there in the new versus old AEs? Could this effect be modeled appropriately? If not, are the models I and others are looking at realy representative of the drivers? Edited to reflect Chrisbee's post...didn't see it when I posted.
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 12:13:20 GMT -7
Post by carvernut on Mar 8, 2008 12:13:20 GMT -7
So in your experience the difference in low end extension will not be significant or very noticeable once installed? yes the depth is very noticable in a good way... things are much more realistic and sound so much more musical and lifelike as far as the upper frequencies... i tend to boost treble from 8,000 - 14,000 because i like more clarity to the music, plus it tends to bring out the richness in horns but i would say probably back the higher end down to meet with the bass
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 12:28:16 GMT -7
Post by bricktop on Mar 8, 2008 12:28:16 GMT -7
carvernut, when I said extension I was meaning the extra extension of the modeled AEs versus the ficars. Maybe you post was an answer to that though...not sure.
In general that is what my goal will be with the IB system...I want very low, strong extension, but with great authority.
Thanks, Jonathon
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 13:14:42 GMT -7
Post by ThomasW on Mar 8, 2008 13:14:42 GMT -7
It is interesting how much more power is required to achieve the same roll off with the 32Hz drivers using BFD boost compared with the new drivers. In practice the new IB15s are very much louder than the old. At east 6dB and probably more. I'm quite sure this is a function of the extremely stiff spider on the original AE drivers. I think it's going to be problematic to get a good match between the different sets of drivers. Are you running out of Xmax with the new drivers, or is this for 'bragging rights"?....
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AE IB15
Mar 8, 2008 13:43:44 GMT -7
Post by ThomasW on Mar 8, 2008 13:43:44 GMT -7
carvernut, when I said extension I was meaning the extra extension of the modeled AEs versus the ficars. Maybe you post was an answer to that though...not sure. In general that is what my goal will be with the IB system...I want very low, strong extension, but with great authority. Both Kevin and I have posted that the difference is Fs isn't an issue. You've been told about and shown the effects of room-gain, so I'm not sure what else to add. If you want to invest in software there are programs that will model the effects of room-gain. Be prepared to feed the programs a lot of data regarding the construction characteristics of the room.... home.comcast.net/~thomasw-2/SubwooferSetupandEQpage12.html
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